Speaker 1: 1:25

What's going on everybody? Welcome to the show. This is the Next Level Human Podcast. I'm your host, dr Jay Tita, and I am here with two of my very good and close friends, rachel Bowers and Tabitha Simmons, two individuals who I have gotten to know over the last couple years. We actually did a retreat together several years back now and fell in love with both of them, and they have begun to do something that I really wanted to make sure I highlighted on this particular podcast. So Tabitha and Rachel have started a clinic called Halcyon Health and, more important than that, they have begun to become a voice in the hormone space and, in particular, the female hormone space.

Speaker 1: 2:09

And so many of you know that this was my work for a very long time and I stopped doing this work probably around five to seven years ago, mostly because two things really a lot of amazing female practitioners came into the space when that really didn't exist on a high level prior to that. In my opinion, and as I was telling Tabitha and Rachel right before we hit record, I just have, you know, this sort of weird thing. I guess some people might say that I don't think men are best served to be the ones doing this work because they don't actually have the real experience, real experience. And so what I have wanted to do for quite some time is to really get more women in this conversation and hand off that expertise that many of you know me from to people who I think are better qualified than myself. And let me kind of set this up too, because Rachel and Tabitha are sisters, they're very good friends of mine and they come at this from a slightly different perspective. Tabitha and I kind of share the philosophy aspect of this and show so she can really articulate well, sort of the philosophical aspects of this. But Rachel and I really share the science based aspects of this and can sort of dialogue on that.

Speaker 1: 3:27

Of course, all of us are well versed in this area, but I think this really should get us started, rachel and Tab, because from my perspective there are two aspects to this thing, right. First of all, there's the cultural, psychology, philosophy, mindset, sort of where we have arrived in terms of health care and specifically female health, and then there's sort of the cutting edge science aspect, and so, if you don't mind, what I want to do maybe is start with you, tabitha, and talk a little bit about why you two decided to do this and I especially think it's cool that two sisters are doing this but what was the sort of the dream, the kind of thing that spurred you to go? You know what? This is something we have to do, because I know you have some entrepreneurial background in another space, in the hospitality industry, and now you're moving into this realm, and so tell us why you thought this was so important.

Speaker 2: 4:27

So for me I mean I'm 48, so I've been a patient of Rachel's for eight years and really what started my, or what sparked, I should say, my passion for this is my experience with Rachel as a patient and as I started to understand more about my own physiology and how my body was working and changing as I was aging and how hormones impacted that, alongside my experience with other doctors you know, whether it be an internist or a cardiologist or whatever it was in relation to my experience with Rachel, and then started to hear my peers talk about sort of you know what, how their experience of health and how that was changing as they aged. And I started to notice sort of a trend and it's interesting the way you set it up. One thing I observed is that you know we are told as women so often that our experience of middle age is just part of life, right, and that it is part of just getting older, part of being a mom, like part of, like the stress, the mood changes, the changes in our bodies, like the lack of energy, the changes in our body composition all of those things are just, you know, part of being female. Contrast that with the male space where there's just a lot of hyper focus on how to optimize, right, one's health in the male world, right? And how to be the best version of yourself and bigger muscles. I mean, there's billboards all over the place talking about testosterone in men and how to make things better. Sex drive that's a big one, right. To make things better Sex drive that's a big one, right. Wouldn't it be nice if you had a great sex drive as a man and your partner shared that sex drive, right?

Speaker 2: 6:16

And I just started to observe that, even like you said, women practitioners are also sort of brainwashed in a way to believe that that is not something that warrants focus. And, as you noted, it is scientific, right. There are ways to understand, from a scientific perspective, the way our bodies change and the things that are happening. And Rachel started to do that and she started to ask the questions and she started to say you know, why aren't we doing this for women? Why? Why am I seeing this trend and we're not managing it this way? And you know, we started to talk about it and I just I felt like something had to be done. They're just we couldn't, um, we just don't deserve, you know to, to live the next 40, 50 years of our life, less than less than our best.

Speaker 1: 7:14

Yeah, it is a really interesting sort of dynamic that we have where it's like, okay, optimize male function, and you know, uh, just uh, solve, you know, sort of symptoms, uh, for the female population for sure, and yeah, and, and you know, and part of that and this is where you know I want to kind of get you in, rachel, you know, part of that is, I think, uh, many of my people who listen to this podcast know this, but let's just talk about this briefly. Like one of the things, when I first started doing research in this area and this would have been in the late nineties, early 2000s, as I was finishing up medical school I couldn't find anything, virtually anything, in the research on female health. And I remember talking to one of my professors at the time who was doing research primarily on men at University of Washington in the exercise science department there, and I remember asking you know what's up with this lack of research? And you know what he said to me he's like well, you can't, you really can't control for the menstrual cycle. The menstrual cycle throws all of this off, and so we basically just do the research on men. And I remember thinking to myself we basically just do the research on men, and I remember thinking to myself okay, so basically we're throwing out half of the population simply because the hormonal situation is a little more complicated, and it just made me my mind, I remember, at that time, just went exploded, because I was working with primarily women as a personal trainer while I was in medical school and it was at that moment I realized everything that I thought I knew about endocrine physiology and fitness.

Speaker 1: 8:56

I kind of needed to start over because it wasn't being studied Now. Now we're in a very different place, but also I think you know, and I want to hear what you have to say on this, rachel, also, I still think, despite the fact that there's a lot of chatter about this, all of a sudden I still feel like we're relatively in maybe not the dark ages, but we're still in the middle ages of, you know, female healthcare, in terms of what Tabitha was talking about, in terms of optimizing hormone function, and so I want to just get a sense as a, as a fellow practitioner what are your thoughts on this? Do you you know, and what is your approach and what do you think is being missed by most practitioners out there even still?

Speaker 3: 9:39

It wasn't mandated by the NIH until 1994 that women had to be included in research studies. So prior to that they could do them and they could include women, but they didn't. They didn't have to. So they could do them and they could include women, but they didn't have to. So they could do all of these research and it was all on men, like you pointed out. And then it came, shortly after that, the Women's Health Initiative, and that was a huge study of tens of thousands of women that basically told I mean it was multifactorial.

Speaker 3: 10:08

One of the pieces of the Women's Health Initiative was studying hormones in women aged like 68 to 75-ish range, and they studied two synthetic hormones and they found that they were. They caused. The ultimate result was that they caused, that they caused harm, so cancer, blood clot, stroke, heart attack, and so that was the message and that was the message from like basically, 2000 until pretty much, I want to say, in the last two years. The message has been that hormones are bad and women just need to suck it up and deal with it. And if you want to try hormones, you're going to be hard pressed to find a practitioner that's going to know about them and think that they're safe enough to prescribe.

Speaker 3: 10:56

So we're battling this science-based claim that hormones are bad for us, when you know if you're thinking from just like a pure logical standpoint our body makes estrogen and progesterone. Why would giving estrogen and progesterone causes harm? But that's what the message is. And so then we're battling, from a practitioner standpoint, this well, very well seeded belief from the population that hormones are scary and bad and they're going to give me cancer, from the population that hormones are scary and bad and they're going to give me cancer. And then you are also battling the general medical population being trained in medical schools that hormones cause cancer, blood clot, stroke and all of those things. And so it's. It's a huge roadblock to cancer, to trying to reach people, not just from a medical standpoint, but still if, if they are in the uh, traditional allopathic md space.

Speaker 1: 12:15

I still find that unless they are endocrinologists and even this is slow moving a little bit they still are reluctant uh to deal with uh hormones. And at the same time, I have never seen in my clinical practice a woman not completely get better on all levels with hormone replacement therapy. And, by the way, this is even before we were mostly doing natural hormone replacement therapy. Even with the equine estrogens and some of the progestins I would see women improve pretty dramatically in my clinic. Now, since you know, we have gone almost entirely to natural hormone replacement therapy.

Speaker 1: 12:58

But and to your point, the Women's Health Initiative study and this is really hard but and I know people get frustrated with science but after decades of looking at this research, the messaging there was also wrong. So now we know that these risks were essentially nonexistent, with very little downside in these women, and so I think this is a big piece of what has happened. Now, of course, for those of you listening, we've now moved on a great deal. Right, it's been 20 plus years now where we now have really good data, we have really good practitioners, we have really good protocols and procedures and we are seeing phenomenal strides, I think, finally in female healthcare. And what I want to know, rachel, from you all is what is it that you feel like you are doing that most other practitioners aren't? What is it that you feel like we still need work with or we still need help with, or is still a big misconception in this area that you're addressing at Halcyon Health?

Speaker 3: 14:08

Well, one of the big ones with women is that menopause, perimenopause, equals hot flashes, fatigue and night sweats, and that's basically what it is and that if we can just fix those symptoms, we're doing a good job. And I will argue, we want to fix those symptoms. We don't want to have patients be fatigued and experiencing hot flashes and night sweats, but that's just the tip of the iceberg what we can do with hormone replacement. If you really know the science behind how hormones work in the body, they are essential to pretty much every single function on a cellular level in our body, from brain to bones, to skin, to eyes in our body, from brain to bones, to skin, to eyes. You know, you name it and if we so, yes, I want to help you feel better and look better and not experience these superficial symptoms, but deep down, I really want to improve your overall physiology and biological health. So you know another I think buzzword out there is like your biological age. So you know another, I think buzzword out there is like your biological age. And.

Speaker 2: 15:22

I think that's one way that we can improve your biological age is by optimizing the hormones, not just superficially to get rid of the symptoms, but also to improve underlying physiology. And I think one thing too, to add to that, because it's easier for me to brag about her than it is for her to brag about herself, but I think, and in general, what is necessary in the world is that you know two things. One, rachel is willing to take the time to educate her patients. So not only does she understand the physiology, not only does she understand how hormones impact us at a cellular level, but she's willing to communicate that to her patients and break it down for them in a way that's easy for them to digest and understand. And that's important for for a lot of reasons. But one reason that I see is that the only way we change this is by learning how to advocate for ourselves as patients, not accepting you know, this is just how it is but asking our, our practitioners, what? What does it mean to me right when you, when you have diagnosed me with something, or when you have prescribed me something, what does that mean? How does that work in my body? How you know what I'm saying we need to, we need to understand it and we need to advocate for ourselves.

Speaker 2: 16:25

I think with these professions I'm a lawyer, I get it. Lawyers, doctors, you know the science, the MDs, the ISTs, the biologists, whatever it is we put them on a pedestal and we look to them to have all the answers, and that's unfair right. We need to understand our bodies, we need to do our own research, we need to develop our own awareness and then we need to fight for ourselves in this space. And Rachel is a practitioner where, if you show up knowing and asking questions, you will be heard and she will have the conversation with you and she will collaborate with you in coming up with a plan that works best for you. And I think that's the best recipe and coming up with a plan that works best for you and I think that's the best recipe.

Speaker 1: 17:12

Yeah, I agree a hundred percent. I think it really comes down to individualized medicine, and that is a topic that you know. Lots of people will say that individualized, you know we do individualized medicine, but it's still, you know, a protocol-based, recipe-based approach that's not necessarily taken to account the individual and here's the way I break this down to, or I typically break it down to, the listeners. I mean, yes, I spent my whole career understanding the differences between male and female endocrinology. So it is important and we can certainly, on one level, as we get to the individualized approach, we certainly can say okay, there's men and there's women. Obviously, women have two major sex steroids. Men have one female hormone cycle throughout the month. Females have five different hormonal stages, four or five, depending on whether they go through pregnancy in their life. Men have two, so there's some big differences here.

Speaker 1: 20:42

But then what I really love what you said, dan Tapley, because to me I go OK, that's just the start.

Speaker 1: 20:48

Now, of course, a lot of practitioners aren't even looking at it from that perspective. They're still just going OK, you know, just cookbook here's, here's hormone replacement therapy for men or for women, but the magic really starts to happen when you're like, ok, you know, let's take a look at this particular woman and how she is faring and what is going on with her libido and what is going on with her mood and what is going on with her hunger and her energy and her cravings, and how is her mental and emotional state through these transitions. And to me that's where I think sort of the magic happens. And so I know that you, this is what essentially you all are doing in your center, but I don't know if you, this is what essentially you all are doing in your center. But I don't know if you want to say any more about that, rachel, in terms of your, your approach to this, if you agree with it or you feel like I'm missing something there.

Speaker 3: 21:39

No, absolutely.

Speaker 3: 21:40

I think that that's definitely one of the things that I've struggled with in traditional medicine, cause, as you know, I've been in traditional medicine space for 20 years and then doing the hormone stuff kind of on the side for the last eight to nine years, and, um, that's what I've struggled with.

Speaker 3: 21:58

I don't have the time to individualize your plan as much Like I do my best in the like 10 to 15 minutes that I have, but it's very difficult to explain to a patient what a medication is, why you need it and how to use it, and then why it's important to be consistent from now until the next appointment in 10 minutes, plus address whatever concerns they have.

Speaker 3: 22:21

And so I think that with with this kind of space, we're able to expand the time that we're spending with patients and then really talk to them about what their goal is in terms of their health, because every single person is different, and then from there, I can explain how hormones may impact them in terms of their specific goals and educate them as to why these are important. And what I see is that patients are far more likely to comply and continue the therapy when they understand why we're doing it, versus just telling them like okay, this is the plan, you take these medications and come and see me in two months. They're less likely to really comply with that and especially if they have any kind of side effects, then they're far less likely to comply. So yeah, I think um super important.

Speaker 1: 23:14

Yeah. And so tell me, what are you all, what kind of uh people are you actually seeing at your clinic? So I know, so those of you in the Vegas area right, I don't know where exactly you all are, but I know they're in the Las Vegas area, halcyon Health you definitely are going to want to check it out, but so who's showing up? And, by the way, I've seen the images of this space. It's just absolutely beautiful what you all are doing here. So tell me about your let's go through sort of the experience at your center and sort of who's showing up there. I'm so interested to know how it's going.

Speaker 2: 23:55

Well one. It is interesting. One of the things that we didn't mention is that Rachel's approach isn't just the medical side, it's also the lifestyle right, and so we both have incorporated lifestyle changes to improve our health and our health, you know, our longevity right, and that, combined with hormone management, is like the special sauce. And so what we wanted to do at Halcyon is have a very comfortable, inviting, warm space where you could have these conversations with your practitioner, like you said, the individualized, often vulnerable conversations about how you feel, how you want to feel, how you want to live, and then have these other sort of treatment modalities, if you will, that support that. So contrast therapy we have a dry heat sauna, 190 degree dry heat sauna. We have a cold plunge. We have IV therapy, we have NAD shots, b12 shots, in a beautiful, comfortable space. Rachel can speak to her, to her who's who's showing up, but generally it's people that you know look like me, who are my age, that look like both of us women in their, in their forties. But I will say, though, what's been interesting about this is that we live in a toxic world, you know, and we are living high intensity lives, and that is changing the way our bodies react to aging and we, rachel, has patients that are in their 30s.

Speaker 2: 25:25

Certainly, hormone imbalances are not just for 40 something year old women or old people, they're just not, and so it's been very fascinating to me to see the different types of people that come into the space and that follow Rachel. Yeah, it's been pretty. It's been pretty powerful. I love it because I'm, like you know, been pretty powerful. I love it because I'm, like you know, really anxious and excited to see all my peers really starting to understand and advocate for themselves and then get the benefits of it. It's really phenomenal. Once you are with someone who is your partner and who can collaborate with you on your health, it really is like you said, it's magic.

Speaker 1: 26:04

Yeah, you want to know something else I'll say about you two, is that? So you know, I'm trying to think it's what? Is it Four years now since we both first met and I swear the two of you look like you de-aged?

Speaker 3: 26:15

in the last few years.

Speaker 1: 26:16

Like you both. Like you both look absolutely phenomenal, right. So it's like really interesting to see, it's really fun to see like, okay, these are two people who basically opened up a center, uh, and they live this lifestyle and like it really is like from, you know, from weight loss to skin tone, to the way you're glowing, like you, you both look absolutely phenomenal. And it reminded me when I was seeing um, you know all the stuff that you were putting out with halcyon. It reminds me, you know this whole third space sort of thing where people are like it.

Speaker 1: 26:47

It used to be the coffee shop right, then it used to be the gym and what I thought when I saw your space I was like, oh my God, this is so interesting that this sort of clinic space that most people wouldn't necessarily see, it's like I want to go hang out there as my third space. You know what I mean. I want to go, I want to go hang out at the clinic for half the day. So it has this sort of, you know, day spa sort of feel. But there's also sort of this, you know, really high touch, advanced, you know, natural medicine lifestyle component that you all are bringing. So, yeah, I really you know just kind of love, and how many people, rachel, by the way are doing HRT and you know how, how many? How many people are there just for their general health, or is it you know specific to almost everybody's? On a hormone replacement therapy?

Speaker 3: 27:38

No, it, um, it's.

Speaker 3: 27:40

I would say the majority is hormone replacement, but I have I was just going to say when you were Tab was talking about, you know the 30 somethings. I have mothers calling me up and asking me to evaluate their daughters who are like early twenties, because they're struggling with period irregularities and fatigue and weight gain and all their gynecologist wants to do is put them on birth control and they want an alternative. And so I may not. Obviously at 20, they likely don't need estrogen and things like that. But there are other things that we can do to help them, to optimize their health at 20, to help improve their cycle and the way they feel during their cycle and all of that.

Speaker 3: 28:23

So it is a very varied population and although we do both men and women, I would say it's predominantly women that have come in and have sought us out. I think because men you know there's so many of these, you know testosterone clinics all around, so they have so many options, whereas women don't. I mean they're gynecologists. Most of them will just flat out say I don't check hormones and if you want those you're going to have to find somebody else, um and so, and then if they do offer it, it's like we were talking about it's very cookie cutter, formulaic type of medicine and patients are just like I don't really feel a big difference or I'm just not feeling my best with this, this plan. So, yeah, it's a very, very wide range of people that I'm seeing.

Speaker 2: 29:12

And we're new Jade, so we, we really just opened. I mean, we've been open like two months, so, yeah, so, getting people to, to see the space and to understand, to make it their third space is is where it's a work in progress. Their third space is where it's a work in progress. I have to say, though, okay, that we went to your next level human retreat in 2021, and it absolutely transformed us, and we had been talking about the clinic, you know, right up until then and during that time, but it wasn't a real thing. And then things you said that obviously, the experience of just sort of cracking us open and giving us more courage and confidence to approach this type of endeavor was definitely happened there.

Speaker 2: 33:04

And then you talked about you said the thing that you said in the beginning of this about women and science and not being considered, and you talked about estrogen and progesterone being sisters, and you exposed us to sauna house, and we had the most profound winter walking down the street in the snow with like wet hair after a two hour invigorating sauna experience. So, basically, you're our partner in this thing invigorating sauna experience. So basically, you're our partner in this thing. Jade jade is really a founding member of halcyon health. Um, but seriously, if it wasn't for you? Honestly, you really are a big part of what inspired us to to be here and to get here, and I really mean that from the bottom of my heart. It was. There's so much of what we created in this space was inspired by you and our experience with you, so that's the truth.

Speaker 1: 33:59

Yeah, I love that experience with you two so much. Right, it's like that was the first time that I did a live event for Next Level Human and I made I feel like just a lifelong you know family there. So the feeling is mutual and you and bringing that up. Here's what I really want to get into, because this is really what I know you two are very much into and I think we'd be remiss if we didn't cover this.

Speaker 1: 34:24

One of the interesting things I think about as we age, men and women, is that this thing about our purpose and taking our struggles and our pain and turning it into purpose and creating something that grows us but also enriches others and sort of evolves our little part of the planet. And to me, this is what I get perhaps excited about the most, about what you, you two, are doing. It's almost as if you're like you know, think about this from the perspective of you know um, two sisters. You know they, they, you, you know you all don't know them. I do a little bit, but went through a really tough time lost their dad, all the things you know, going through this particular you know um, this particular age and you know not having a whole lot of answers and then, you know, kind of coming together and building something that really solves the same problems they were struggling with for other humans.

Speaker 1: 35:28

I really think that that's why we're on the planet in the first place, and I kind of wanted to just get your both of your sense about this that I tend to think Now, of course, it is where I focus my attention, so I am a little bit more biased, but I tend to think this is what people are missing Now, of course, when they don't feel optimized.

Speaker 1: 35:48

You know, we all know what it's like when your energy is low and you have all this extra weight on you and you feel inflamed and you feel all that it's hard to focus on. Like, what do I want to do to get to give back? So, from my perspective, though, what's really interesting about watching you two is that you were helping people meet that level so that they can elevate as humans, and to me that's why we're on the planet. But I do want to just briefly ask you about, you know, sort of that mindset and what's driving you and what you think is really missing in the clients who come to you. Just simply, you know, besides hormone replacement and all those things like what are you actually seeing? Are you seeing it the same way that I'm seeing it? And how's it, how's it feel for the both of you as you sort of embark on this sort of it's kind of a higher journey? It's definitely not just about hormone replacement therapies and that kind of stuff.

Speaker 3: 36:48

Well.

Speaker 2: 36:49

I well, I think you're right on. I think Rachel's going to tell you about her experience with her patients. Oh sorry, I think we're talking over each other because of the delay.

Speaker 1: 37:01

No, it's okay.

Speaker 3: 37:02

Go ahead. No, that's all right, Go ahead.

Speaker 1: 37:03

Rach yeah, go ahead.

Speaker 3: 37:06

Okay. So what I was going to say in terms of purpose for me, you know. As you know, jade, building your own business is very difficult and if you're not business minded, it's even more difficult, very challenging for me to get through some of the things that we've had to do over the last few years just to open, and then what we have to continue to do to promote ourselves. It's just not in my wheelhouse right. So there have been lots of times where I've had a lot of doubt like am I doing the right thing? Is this good for me? But when I really sit down and think about it, this is how I impact people and that's ultimately what fuels me and gets me going through the day, like those patients who come in who I haven't seen in a year, who are like oh my gosh, rachel, I've sent so many people to you you you were the first person that listened to me and really gave me an understanding of what was going on and took the time to help me feel better.

Speaker 3: 38:05

Um, that that is the kind of um response that I get more often than not for my patients and when I think about not doing it in this space and giving them the time that they deserve. Um, it's, it's saddening, you know it's. It's it's soul crushing and disheartening to think about going backwards to that. So, even though doing something like this is so incredibly difficult for me, the purpose that it is fulfilling for me is so much greater than any hardship I will have to build the business. So I just have to keep reminding myself that that's the ultimate purpose of this is to help people and get them to feel seen and heard in this particular space and her in, you know, in this particular space. And then, when it comes to my patients individually, in terms of their purpose, I feel like sometimes they come in thinking I'm just going to prescribe them a medication and I'll say well, what's your morning look like?

Speaker 1: 39:00

You know what do you do you know?

Speaker 3: 39:02

do you look at your phone immediately when you wake up? Do you do you go? I talk a lot about like waking up, taking 15 minutes to have a glass of water, go outside and put your face in the sunshine. That is a huge like biohack for improving the way your body functions physiologically and psychologically for the day. Psychologically for the day, and those kinds of things are what help us to then focus on our purpose, because we then have the little boost of energy from that tiny little commitment to ourselves for the first 15 minutes of the day. So I talk about all of those kinds of things with the patient in addition to what we could do and what we can prescribe.

Speaker 1: 39:49

Yeah, I love that so much.

Speaker 1: 39:50

Let me just say something before I get your your thoughts on that, tabitha.

Speaker 1: 39:54

I I love what you're saying, rachel, because what I can say, I think, without a shadow of a doubt, when I was doing more protocol based stuff take this supplement, even take this drug or, you know, take this particular hormone and I was not dealing with basic physiology, basic connection to nature, sunshine, clean water, basic nutrition and how we're relating to our fellow humans what would happen is I can only get people so far, and so I think that's what makes an extraordinary practitioner from my point of view, and I just don't see still practitioners like that, and that's what I think is so amazing about the approach, rachel, and people like you and me and Tabitha.

Speaker 1: 40:43

I think we still have to continue to talk about this idea that you get charged up naturally from these natural things, that you're doing very simple things, and then also, what keeps you charged up is bringing this to your purposeful life, and I do think that people are disconnected from this. They tend to see like I'll go to halcyon to get you know this and then I'm not going to worry about anything else, when it's really like no, you come to Halcyon, to really learn how to live in alignment once again with nature, get optimized with your hormones so that you can then go out into the world and be your best self, and I'm not sure all practitioners are putting it together that way, but to me that's when people start going okay. Life is really, really amazing and good, and so I just love hearing you know sort of that approach.

Speaker 2: 41:39

Yeah, it's like on that, the path to actualization if your basic needs aren't met, you can't take the next step. And this is like your basic needs, you know connecting with nature, committing to yourself, getting your hormones balanced this is like the basic thing. And then after that it all feels so much more like gravy. And I will say that I that you know when we talk about purpose, there's a lot of talk about it now and there, always there has been but there's a lot of talk talk about it, particularly in in in this space and those that follow you, and I think it's really intimidating because purpose feels like something so extraordinary, um, and so it's really hard to to imagine doing something like Gandhi or whatever you know, like Martin Luther. It's like I'm not that guy.

Speaker 2: 42:29

And I think that what I have discovered in this path, starting with the experience we had with you, Jade, was that that purpose isn't extraordinary, it's just being true to yourself, and that the more you come back to that and the more that you are true to yourself and pick your pain because it is incredibly painful and hard to experience lack of alignment Right, it's really hard and it's really hard to do things every day that make you miserable, and it's also hard to choose yourself. It's hard to be truthful to yourself and it's hard to choose, choose authenticity. But I can tell you what you're you're much more likely, or maybe the only way you're likely, to find your purpose and to live an ordinary but truly extraordinary life is through that, that coming back to yourself. So you get your basic needs met, you come to Rachel, you advocate for yourself, you connect with nature and then you embark on that path of finding truth and you will find your purpose. It will just happen. It is not something that is really remarkable, it's just, it's very natural.

Speaker 2: 43:43

That's what we're meant to do as humans, you know.

Speaker 1: 43:46

Yeah, we really are, and it's so well, so well said, tabitha. You're so brilliant in this way. I also want to say that me, knowing tabitha, you know talk about alignment and stepping into. You know your fear and stepping into like all the things that you need to do to clear your life, to get better. I mean you're like the perfect example of this. Like I'm thinking about all the things you've been through since you and I first met and it's like a lot of disruption, but like, look at where you're, you are and and I and the reason I kind of bring this up is because I do think, yes, it can seem uh daunting to kind of be like, all right, I need to, I need to, you know, understand my purpose, but really all it is is your purpose is kind of talking to you all the time, and it's not necessarily being in authentic alignment to a past self. That's the hard part. It's being in authentic alignment to the future, you and so when Rachel and Tabitha had sort of this dream, you know they started to and I actually I want to just walk through how I see this and I want you both to correct me with this, because I think this is such a cool hero's journey. In a sense, there's this thing that happens when you come together and you go what is our history? What is the past history? What is what is our history given us the skills to do? And in this case you both have complimentary skills and then it's basically looking out into the future and saying what have I been prepared, what has life been preparing me to do, and am I brave enough to step into that authentic alignment and shed the old skin? And the hard part is shed all the old people and places and stories that are attached to that old skin. That's where we get afraid, I think, and you two have just crushed that, and I know how difficult it is and continues to be, because that's the process right for all of us. So I love that you're kind of saying pick your struggle, because you're going to struggle in either way, but the most painful struggle is being out of alignment to that authentic next level human self. So I just think it's so well said. And what I want to do as we kind of wrap up, if you all don't mind, I do want to give um, just some take-homes like some, just some general things that the listeners can kind of do from two women who have essentially you know, from my perspective, over the last four years I mean talk about optimized.

Speaker 1: 46:18

You both have done something so incredible in terms of the way that you are functioning, the way you look, the way you must feel on the inside and what you're creating in the world us feel on the inside and what you're creating in the world. And so I just want to give you a chance to you know, give the advice or, you know, tell a little bit more about your story or where people should start on this journey, if they are. You know a woman who is in their late thirties, early forties, you know fifties, up to sixties, and they're feeling like this is broken. I got nobody to sort of lean on. I mean, I think you've, you've found your sort of two. You know mentors right here. So I'm wondering what, what you want to say to that, if anything like any to do's, to give or anything like that.

Speaker 2: 47:04

Well, I think, um, when it comes to your health, I think don't accept if you don't feel like your best, if you don't feel like you did at some point in the past, or just like you should, and you don't have the energy to do the things that you love, or if you don't feel your best psychologically, don't accept that there isn't a solution. Don't accept that. I think that's the first thing. There is a lot of resources out there and you can find a practitioner that will listen to you and help you embark on that journey of hormone health. I think that's the first thing.

Speaker 2: 47:45

Thing, really, that I want to say, for me personally, is kind of what I said for those listening that it isn't that try not to get overwhelmed or discouraged by this this thought of of becoming or finding your purpose or living your purpose that it really is a simple path. There's a ton of different ways that that people can do it and there's a ton of different resources out there for beginning that journey. But it's not about being Oprah Winfrey or Martin Luther King Jr All those people are fantastic and have had amazing impact on our world but you can, too, just by being you, and I think that it is not something that should be daunting, it's something that should be exciting. So that's my little two cents Rach. Do you have anything to add to that?

Speaker 3: 48:35

Yeah, I would just say that, when it comes to your journey to your purpose and as well as your hormone journey or health optimization journey, it's not a race and you can take as long or as or as fast as you want to go to, to get to to health optimization and what, and it's not necessarily a journey, it is a, it is a constant evolution and that evolution is not linear. And so you, you have made, you may make huge strides at some points and then you may be, you know, a snail's pace at other, at others. So, um, just keeping in mind that you know, whatever timeframe you are taking in order to achieve your best self is the right one.

Speaker 1: 49:27

So yeah, actually I want to say something about that Super powerful Rachel, for this is kind of relatively new science and not a lot of people are talking about it. But what Rachel just pointed out to all of you is the number one reason, basically in neuroscience, why people fail to make change. Because what they do is they create and set up this success, failure, you know, sort of conundrum, and it triggers an area of the brain called the habenula which shuts down willpower. And so when you have a practitioner who basically is telling you, enjoy the process, you arrive, when arrival is no longer the goal, what that essentially is doing is it's keeping this habenula hijack from happening, whereas the rest of the world is saying, oh, you have to do it this way and this doesn't look good, so you failed again. And anytime you even perceive failure, you shut down your willpower.

Speaker 1: 50:24

So many of you listening to this right now are at this place where you're like nothing's going to work for me because your habanula has been hijacked so many times. And so what you're saying there, from my perspective, rachel, is perhaps the most powerful thing and powerful message that we can get in medicine and self-development right now, that we need to realize that this approach is it's just always be learning. It's not a success, failure. You start where you are and you begin the process and you're always in process and that mindset of always be learning is, I think, one of the most healing things that we can do, because without that mindset you're essentially shutting down any desire to move forward. So I just think it's so well said and I've been talking a lot more about this as science is becoming clear why so many people fail, so it doesn't surprise me that you and I sort of share that, that mentality.

Speaker 3: 51:21

And also just looking at failure more as like it's data. It's not an end point, you know, and with that data, then you can learn from that and move forward and become better from from there. And if you don't ever have failure, how are you ever going to improve? So failure is really just data to help us improve our ourselves, one incremental piece at a time.

Speaker 1: 51:47

So, yeah, yeah, Failure is learning.

Speaker 1: 51:49

I mean like it really is, like it's, it's actually the way that we learn.

Speaker 1: 51:53

It's funny, too right, because saying that as a practitioner like one of the things that I used to say to my patients all the time, when you get back blood work, you know and you're looking at hormone optimization in particular, you're just like this is just a start, like this is really good information.

Speaker 1: 52:05

It's like you're constantly saying this is such good information for us. This is really good information for us, because as we gather that data, it's the way that we tweak and adjust and get better and better, and so you all definitely want practitioners who are looking at things that way. The last thing you want is a practitioner to just be going oh, you know, these numbers aren't right and not explaining how good it is sometimes when you don't get exactly where you want to go, because those are the moments that a good practitioner is actually going to do their best, their best work. So why don't you guys tell them where they can find you all online, and you know, I think both Rachel and Tabitha are online and Halcyon Health now has an online spot as well. So how can people get in touch with you if they want to work with you.

Speaker 2: 52:57

We're Halcyon Optimized right, wwwhalcyonoptimizedcom. And then we can be found on Instagram and Facebook. It's at halcyonhealth. Where else can we be found? We are on all the platforms, but at Halcyon health is the best way to find us. And then I am Tabitha Simmons is my Instagram and Rachel is what is your Instagram reach?

Speaker 3: 53:22

Optimized by Rachel.

Speaker 1: 53:24

Yeah, and if you need help finding them, just go to my page and I follow all three. They're my besties and so you can find them there as well. But I adore you both and I'm so glad we all got to hang out. And if you're in the Vegas area, definitely go and check out Tabitha and Rachel and I was telling Tabitha we were talking recently. I'm like I want to come see you and hang because I want to see this place, so hopefully I'm going to be there soon as well, but I adore you both. Do me a favor, hang on the line, just so I can make sure this uploads. And for all of you, I'm super excited you got to meet my, my two sweet, dear friends, and I hope that you will check them out and learn from these two amazing teachers and we will see you at the next podcast.